"ZX->IBM" or "Problem of the Century"

Hello, All!

I have a quick question. I needed to rewrite txt from a TR-DOS floppy disk
to an IBM one. Or at least look at it. I'm loading the emulator - the floppy disk is unreadable. I'm loading
another emulator, a third, a fourth, all sorts of hobets and similar rubbish. Fig.
And the ZX (which I no longer have) read this floppy disk. Is it like a whole IBM together
with a bunch of vaunted emulators and the hobet can’t read some crummy floppy disk?
Shame on the computer. And anyway, who’s to blame? Has no one really written anything yet
that reads _any_ floppy disks and not just those formatted in ADS2.0...

[ Team HeHeHe ]

O venerable Andrey!

Sun Mar 16 1997 Andrey Kythevich --> All :

AK> There is a question to fill in. I needed to rewrite txt from a TR-DOS
AK> floppy disk on an IBM. Or at least view it. I'm loading the emulator - the floppy disk is not
AK> readable. I'm loading another emulator, the third, the fourth, all sorts of hobets and so on

Floppy disks written on all three of my Sinclair drives, (among them there are
the most worthy ones - :( in on the opposite side from Tic) were perfectly readable on
all IBM machines where I put them.
About the technology:
- for transferring text: on the ZX there are formatters for MS-DOS that
format a floppy disk at 720k (for example, in the ZX-WORD kit even in version 1.0, Is-Dos, etc.) and there are disk copiers that can both read and writing to such
floppy disks (again, for example, both sets of programs), by the way, you won’t be able to read them head-on either, 720 is not a standard for IBM. To read them, you need to load
some kind of driver like PU_1700, fdread, 800, after all.

- DCU-formatted floppy disks in the usual TR-DOS format are perfectly read
by both the Shalaev emulator and the Shalaev emulator. hobet-oh
- Formatted with other features on my current 1.2 drive are either
readable by one thing, or (in extreme cases, with a large divergence of tracks)
not readable at all, but this is treated with the Restore function of the same DCU at home on ZX
after which everythingread everywhere.

AK> similar trash. Fig.

This is not trash, but excellent programs, like all others, with their shortcomings :), which the authors are struggling to overcome! I take this opportunity to express my personal
gratitude to them.

AK> And ZX (which I no longer have)
AK> read this floppy disk. This
AK> is like a whole IBM along with a bunch of vaunted emulators and hobets

and probably with a 1.2 flop whose head width is twice as narrow as that
FDD on which the floppy disk was written, and accordingly the spread
of parameters in terms of head positioning accuracy is twice as large.
+ the disk drives are adjusted before handing them over to the Sinclair builder
not with a stick or a finger, but...

AK> cannot read

the result may be like this.

AK> some kind of crummy floppy disk?

Especially such floppy disk :)

AK> It's a shame for the computer.

There is some truth in this.

AK> And in general, who is to blame?

Andrey Kythevich

AK> Has no one really written anything yet that reads _any_
AK> floppy disks

And if the drive has heads turned to one side :) ?

AK> and not only formatted in ADS2.0...

Well, I don’t know what it is.

See you soon! Andy.

Mon Mar 17 1997

AK> TR-DOS floppy disks on IBM. Or at least look at it. I'm loading the emulator -
AK> the floppy disk is not readable. I'm loading another emulator, a third, a fourth, all sorts of
AK> hobets and similar rubbish. Fig. And the ZX (which I no longer have)
AK> read this floppy disk. Is it a whole IBM machine along with a bunch of vaunted
AK> emulators and can’t read some crummy floppy disk?
AK> It’s a shame for the computer. And in general, who is to blame?

The native formatter in TR-DOS is to blame + FDD controller on IBM.

These are problems with the controller on IBM, stemming from the fact that the native
TR-DOS format makes too small a space from the beginning of the index marker
(namely, from its beginning, the BETA disk circuit determines the beginning of the track) to the header
of the first sector (which appears even before the end of the index marker).
Disk controller circuits on IBM determine the beginning of the track in different ways. Some
(such as Acer) determine the beginning of the track also by the beginning of the index marker and there are no problems with
them. And others consider the beginning of the track from the end of the index
marker, as a result of which they do not see the title of the first sector. This is why it is recommended to seal half of the hole so that the index marker
ends early, before the start of the first sector heading. Or you just need to
format with the correct formatters.

Best wishes! Michael KLUG

AK>> that

AS> Floppy disks written on all three of my Sinclair drives, (among them
AS> there are the most worthy - :(in the opposite direction from Tic) perfectly
AS> were read perfectly on all IBM machines where I put them.

You're just lucky. I only have every second, and it depends on how it was formatted on the ZX and whether there is copy protection

AS> About the technology: - for
AS> text transfer: there are formatters on the ZX for MS-DOS that format the diskette
AS> at 720k (for example, included in the ZX-WORD kit even in version 1.0,
AS> Is-Dos, etc.) and there are disk copiers which can both read and write
AS> to such floppy disks (again, for example, both sets of programs), by the way
AS> you won’t be able to read them directly, 720 is not a standard for IBM. To read them
AS> you need to load some kind of driver like PU_1700, fdread, 800 into
AS> in the end.

The thing is that I wrote this floppy disk a long time ago and then I didn’t know what to do with it.
format it so that IBM can read it :)

AS> - Floppy disks formatted by DCU in the usual TR-DOS format are perfectly
AS> read by both the Shalaev emulator and hobet - Formatted with other
AS> features on my current 1.2 drive are either read by one thing or
AS> (at the very least case, with a large divergence of tracks) are not readable at all, but
AS>this is treated with the Restore function of the same DCU at home on ZX after which everything
AS> is read everywhere.

I don’t have ZX :(

AK>> similar trash. Fig.

AS> These are not trash, but wonderful programs, like everything with their shortcomings :),
AS> over which the authors are struggling! I take this opportunity to express my
AS> personal gratitude to them.

Why then do floppy disks read every other time and _slow_?

The point is not that no one can write, but that the majority of
IBM controllers are _physically_ not capable of reading disks formatted
(in the standard way) on Sinclair.

AS> Well, I don’t know what it is.

8-[ ]

Have a nice connection.
Roman.

Tuesday, March 18, 97, already 11:39

... UI120:MNFIAKIHAAADGFXKGAEGDFHIHHMBBIPFLQAAOGKCHKF

AK> is being read. I'm loading another emulator, a third, a fourth, all sorts of hobets and that
AK> similar rubbish. Fig. And the ZX (which I no longer have) read this floppy disk. It's

It's the cartoon's fault :( In TR-DOS, as far as I remember, the wait for reading the 0th
sector was made minimal, and because of this the machine simply cannot read
the 0th sector. Try covering half of the index hole, sometimes helps.
:)

Best wishes, Max.
-=> AKA Tigra <=-
Tue Mar 18 1997 00:12